Monday, February 18, 2008

You Can't Have it Both Ways

In yet another story about the propaganda that the Con's are desparately trying to peddle Prentice say's something rather interesting:

But the Tories are trying to sever any public perception that Mr. Dion is part of the same party that rescued Ottawa's finances a decade ago, saying he's no Paul Martin.

"The Liberals who administered the country in the past are different than the Liberals under Mr. Dion," Mr. Prentice said, advising reporters to be wary if Liberals "try to take you back in a time machine and claim they are the party that slew the deficit."

Let me get this straight. They spend most of their time suggesting that the Liberal's are the same old deal and have learned nothing from ad-scam, but now when it's convenient, they suggest this is not the same Party. He goes on to say:

He said proof of how the party has changed is the fact that former Ontario premier Bob Rae has a key role in it, suggesting that Mr. Dion will copy Mr. Rae's deficit-spending record.

Huh? I don't know the Con's run their cabinet, but something tells me that Harper did not make previous spending decisions based on advice from Peter MacKay. Rae's the Foreign Affairs critic for heavens sake AND while it's nice of Prentice to assume his win before it happens, he's not in Ottawa everyday, he's campaigning for the by-election. Proof? What a ridiculous statement.

Then this:

"The Dion Liberals only know one approach to government: taxes and spending, deficits and debt - the approach that Mr. Rae used to nearly sink Ontario while he was the NDP premier of that province."

Since Dion has never formed government it's remarkable that Prentice knows what his approach to running one would be. The irony of course in citing Rae is the obvious real comparison of what our current Finance Minister did to Ontario. If Rae was the Leader, I could see them using this strategy, but in the real world this is just sophomoric.

Thankfully the Globe journalist, Steven Chase, isn't buying the drivel and makes a point to clear up the misleading information in both the ad and the spiel.

One reason the Conservatives can even raise the spectre of a return to deficits today is they've tapped the treasury heavily for tax breaks and spending since taking power in 2006.

They've nearly emptied Ottawa's coffers of spare cash by taking about $30-billion worth of annual government revenue and doling it out in tax cuts and spending, including $12-billion in reductions to the goods and services tax.

It was former Liberal finance minister Paul Martin who brought an end to 27 years of budget deficits when he balanced Ottawa's books in 1997-1998. Liberals also reduced federal debt by $68.1-billion before losing power in 2006.


The Tories also released a video, ridiculing the Liberal Leader, that includes repeated use of a clip of him saying "megatonnes of money," as if to suggest he will be a big spender. At one point, the video displays text that reads, "The true cost of Stéphane Dion?" Then it plays the clip and follows this up by displaying the figure $62.5-billion.

But the quote comes from speeches Mr. Dion has given where he says he wants Canada to grow rich by becoming a leader in environmental technology that helps reduce greenhouse gas output.

"Yes, Canada will cut megatonnes of emissions, but we will also make megatonnes of money," is the full quote Mr. Dion has used in speeches.

It's nice to see some clarity in the MSM.


wilson said...

But the unelected Bob Rae was appointed, by Dion, to write Lib policy:

'...while fellow leadership candidates Bob Rae and Scott Brison will be in charge of developing the Liberal Party platform for the next election campaign.'

A Dipper and a Cons.

Now, one assumes, when you present a platform (policy) in an election, you would govern by that policy.
So yes, Rae is running the show.

Anonymous said...

"Stephane Dion reiterates that Liberals could let the federal budget pass"

HAHAHAHAHAHA What a pussy.

Tootrusting said...

It is this kind of mis representation of the facts, partial truths lies and smears that turned me of Harpers brand of conservatism a few years ago.

Harper forgets he has a record now, after increasing government spending at 7.5% a year for the last 2 years any talk of fiscal responsibility on his part is a joke.

Red Tory said...

KNB — Glad I don't have to put up with lying douchebags like "Wilson" and the above-noted pusillanimous sock-puppet.

Steve V said...


I was thinking the same thing. These characters constantly refer to the same-old Liberals, and now, when it comes to economics, it's a different gang. The nonsense knows no bounds. I almost wish they still had the "NEW" tag, just for added ridiculousness.

BTW, the Liberals do have Rae, but then again the Conservatives have Flaherty. It's open to debate who left a bigger mess after their tenure. At least Rae didn't lie to voters....

Karen said...

wilson, with respect, developing policy is something that is done with more than just two people. You see, real costing is involved so ideas are developed then passed off to those who can break them down and determine whether or not they are feasible. That feasibility exercise entails both the impact of the program and it's affordability.

To say that Rae is running the show is a nice try, but it's nonsense and it's beneath you and it's beneath your Party to suggest same. Aren't you tired of this dumbing down stuff?

The media is I think. That is becoming evident in terms of how they are reacting to this latest foray. They are finally taking a real look at what the Con's are spinning.

Surely you are too intelligent to support this obvious deception?

I'm surprised more Con's aren't showing more disappointment in how Harper is faring. I'm not speaking of poll numbers now, but he is not telling you what a Conservative future might be. He's focused on the past and is showing a fear of Dion.

If I was a Con, I'd be disappointed and ashamed of how juvenile the government, the Con government is. I suspect many are.

Anonymous said...

Every party is guilty of the same tactics. Libs like to say that the Cons are not the same party of old and that the party was hijacked. In their next breath they will try to tie Harper to anything Mulroney did or past deficits.

Remember Paul Martin in the last election talking about a 40 BILLION DOLLAR BLACKHOLE!! (not sure of the exact number) that he claimed Conservative promises would result in? sound familiar?

Karen said...

glad I never had...

It is people like you that do not employ logic who are the wusses.

Intellect is obviously a foreign concept for you because if the budget is not harmful to the country, why vote it down?

Logic. Make a point to look that up.

Red Canuck said...

KNB - Did you catch Prentice on Politics today? I was so incensed, I had to post about it. His lies were so incredible, I think even he had a hard time spitting them out. He couldn't even bring himself to admit that the Liberals produced balanced budgets under Chretien and Martin, and instead credited "Canadian taxpayers" for those accomplishments. He was such a gutless was hard to watch!

Karen said...

tootrusting, welcome.

You are the conservative supporter that employs thought, that I know are out there.

I should say, I don't expect you to vote Liberal, but I would appreciate an honest review of what you think of what is going on now with someone you trusted to push your platform forward.

Hmmm, honesty seems to be the key word.

Karen said... have done that well. Love your new site. I visit often, comment infrequently, but appreciate always.

Red Tory said...

Trevor — Not exactly a fair comparison given that the Conservatives are a hybrid of different parties and accordingly tend to manifest different characteristics. I would argue that they combine the worst aspects of the old PC Party in terms of their spendthrift habits that produced the last massive deficit, together with the callous, narrow-minded social attitudes of their Reform/Alliance heritage.

Red Tory said...

KNB — Thanks. It's more of a "fun" thing.

Karen said...

Indeed Steve, it's tough to defend Rae's record, but it's complicated. Flaherty? Sorry his record is blatant.

In the end, no matter what Rae puts out there is not a hope in hell that the Lib's will put this country into deficit.

The Con's have nothing, so this is their answer. As usual, they have no vision so they focus on the opposition and the past.

Blame everyone else seems to be their mantra.

You cannot be in government for 2 years and not take responsibility. They are tempering the pot because they have nothing to offer.

ottlib said...


Two words: Tom Flanagan.

He was and is the brain behind the Conservative election platform and their approach to government and he has never held elected office.

So by your logic Mr. Flanagan is running the show since Mr. Harper is "governing" by his policies and ideas.

You know wilson, before you put forth your tripe you should take a look at your own party to be certain that they are not doing the same things you are accusing the Liberals of doing. It makes you look less like a hypocrit.


Denying your political opponent an election call on the issue of his choice is not being a pussy it is being politically astute. Letting the Conservatives twist in the wind for next few months before bringing them down on a issue they are weak on is sound political strategy.

If as expected the budget is some innocuous affair, it will be a one day story and then disappear. There is no point in bringing down the government in such circumstances.


A very good description of the CPC. It makes me wonder which branch of the party is going to abandon it first.

As for the subject of this post I would point out that the Conservatives have been trying to have it multiple ways for years. They have been successful I would add because of the laziness of the MSM. However, as you say knb, the MSM seems to be growing weary of the BS from the Conservatives.

Yet one more reason to delay an election for another few months. Let's see if that weariness takes hold.

Karen said...

RC, I did catch it and I share your rage. I've been feeling it all weekend. Kudo's to Bonner though. She called him on it. He looked like an idiot, but the media is looking smarter. It's about bloody time in my view, but good on them.

My honest view is they, the Con's, have made a big mistake with this one, this particular lie.

Their motive is to have the Lib's cost their plan pre-election. Un-heard of. The audacity of the demand is indicative of their arrogance.

My opinion to the Lib's is, don't do it! The Con's always throw these red herrings out, because they have no direction. They lay traps to sniff out how the big people operate.

They're a joke and I'm pleased that this is finally being exposed.

Karen said...

ottlib, indeed. The House on the weekend made Brian Jean look like an idiot. The Globe story, well done and tonight Susan Bonner was brilliant. She was also tough on McCallum but she had her facts.

I think we are seeing a turn around with media and I'm happy to see so far, that they are as clever as I thought they were.

Partisanship aside, I just want to see these well researched, clever minds telling and exploring the truth.

How did they get so lazy? One day they may tell us.

burlivespipe said...

The unwritten story here is that the CONs have no plan to present... they've popped their cork, so to speak, and only have those dirty, dark alliance-ish items that they wouldn't dare pull out in the light. As you and many of us have said, they have spent so much energy and their agenda on knocking and kicking at the opposition that they've surrendered the floor for others. Where's their vision? What are their promises? More GST cuts? More military spending? A whistle for every cop? How about a tax credit for that asthma you'll be acquiring thanks to the tar sands, mr and mrs northern alberta?
Well, having cleaned out the cupboard, now's the time to act prudent, i suppose. Only Wilson and his moronic circle-jerks are buying that.

RuralSandi said...

You know what we need here in Canada? In the US they have a blog site called "Media Matters" that show what media lies about and/or misconstues. They also have "FactCheck" - which thoroughly checks out the true facts of what candidates claim.

I think we really need this here.

Both sites are non-partisan.

Karen said...

Burl...bang on. They have nothing. Re-phrashed, they have much that they would like to get out there but they do not have the courage to do it.

I do not want to believe we are square one as it relates to finances in this country, but I fear it.

Vision? Hmm, that would require the ability to engage others, even those with whom you disagree and then, gulp, formulate a path based on consensus.

That would be a concept unknown to this government.

Karen said...

Sandi, you're correct, we need that.

I obvously could not do that, but I'll check the sites out and perhaps put out a call for someone who could.