Thursday, August 02, 2007

I'm Afraid the Facts Don't Support the Fiction

I'm afraid our PM is rather delusional.

"Despite the occasional squabbling between governments, the fact of the matter is this - our country has not been this united since our Centennial 40 years ago this year," Harper said to loud applause from about 1,000 Conservatives at a barbecue on the Charlottetown waterfront.

It's one thing to rally the troops, but his over the top rhetoric is laugh out loud funny particularly when you consider this.

No matter what Harper does, he simply isn't getting any traction.

A new Ipsos Reid poll finds that the Conservatives, at 34% support nationally, are down slightly from the results of the General Election in January of 2006 (36%)

I suppose he can be forgiven for trying to raise the spirits of his loyal supporters, as they must be extremely discouraged.

19 comments:

wilson said...

So, are you saying that,
a more united Canada has not moved Conservatives in the polls; or Canada is not more united because if it was, it is of enough importance to Canadians that Cons would be much higher in the polls??

The new leader of the Bloc has put off the separation agenda for 10 years, that is a united Canada.

Anonymous said...

KNB lets talk about delusional. I think the left is the one that's delusional.

Fact: He our PM is right when he says that our country is more united. Here is the example,when the Liberals were in power they almost lost our country has we know it by only 50.000 votes here in Quebec. Since the Conservatives under Stephen Harper took power in January 2006,the separatist in Ottawa the
(Bloc) lost seats and votes,the separatist here in Quebec (PQ) also lost seats and votes they are now the third party in Quebec. The new leader of the PQ now says that the
referendum on Quebec separation is now on hold
because the Quebec people
don't want it. Is everything perfect no is anything perfect in life no.

Now about the poll
34% goes to the Conservatives 32% to the Liberals 17% the the NDP
and 8% to the Greens.

This is what you said
about this recent poll:
"I suppose he can be forgiven for trying to raise the spirits of his loyal supporters, as they must be extremely discouraged."

I can say the same thing about Dion and the
Liberals,because now is when the Liberals should
have the best chance to
win the government,because of the
situation in Afghanistan and in the Atlantic provinces. No one dares to make this government fall because they will lose. Stephen Harper is a smart man he knows that the opposition will not force an election. We hear rumors about a deal
getting close in Halifax
and now we are getting a
exit strategy in Afghanistan then we'll see the polls go higher then 34% and it's only 2% less then what they came to power in 2006! This
government will go untill Sept. 2009 i know it's hard for people on the left to grasp.

John

knb said...

If you two are happy drinking in this nonsense, be my guest.

The Quebec election reduced the real "federalist" party to a minority. The fed's are at odds with Nfld., Sask, and NB. The aboriginal community staged a national day of protest. 2/3 of the country are against the government re' climate change. Bureaucrats, specifically in foreign affairs, are at odds with the governments new direction.

Divisions all. This is by far the most devisive PM I have ever experienced and he does this with only 34% approval. Foolish man.

While I'd like to see Dion's numbers higher, it's not relevant here. He's not the PM. Harper, the PM of the entire country, not just 1/3, has succeeded in dividing this country in ways I never expected to see.

He used the same line at the Canada Day ceremonies and all but his most ardent supporters, laughed out loud, including right wing columnists.

Quebec, since the last referendum, has not been in any position to separate. It's always a concern and will likely always be a concern. To think that 18 months of Harper has made that go away, is hilarious.

Harper continues to waste his breathe preaching to the converted. New converts? Nope, the more he speaks, the more they turn away.

Good news in my books!

Steve V said...

John

You do see the hypocrisy of touting Harper's uniting the country, and then later on citing the trouble with the Atlantic provinces to support your "Liberals should do better" thesis? You get that, right?

Anonymous said...

KNB I'm sorry you feel this way but you know what they say you can't win them all.

It's just too bad that
you can't see the reality
of the situation,because the left is so blinded with haterate of the Harper government that they can't see clearly. It's just amazing to me oh well lets just agree to disagree. Lets not forget that we almost lost our country under
the Liberal government.
We can't win them all
sorry i really am.

John

knb said...

Steve, hypocrisy does not appear to be in the Conservative lexicon, unless of course they apply it to someone else, ;). They appear to have their own definition, in other words. No surprise there.

John, here's something that we agree on. I despise the man and his government. Those are pretty strong words coming from me, but if I'm honest, there it is. As a rule, I go through life accepting differences, embracing them in fact. I draw the line at a leader of the country who is determined to shift it's basic principals to fit his ideology.

Tell me, are you really familiar with his ideology?

Anonymous said...

KNB well are you familiar
with it,I'm sure your going to tell me,because what ever i say you will disagree with me so what is the use?

John ;)

knb said...

Yes, I'm familiar with his ideology, if you aren't but are following him blindly, too sorry you.

I know you're a Reformer...and I'm sure you are pleased to see one of your own as PM.

Can I ask a delicate question? I know how old you are, I know you are in Quebec...were you born there? I was. Nothing you say fit's the profile, so I'm curious.

Anonymous said...

KNB yes i was born here in the great city of Montreal Parents of Italian immigrants,but this is where i end on the personal info. ;) I just would like to add something we may not agree how this country should go forward political,but one think
that i think you would agree with me that our country is the best country on the planet to be in with all it's faults because no country is perfect can we agree on that ? KNB don't take
everything i say personally if i may have
said anything offensive to you personally in the past i oppoligize for that.
One more thing i would like to add MAN OH MAN IS IT EVER HOT HERE this evening;) it feels like 43 with the humidex HOT HOT HOT !!!!

John

Anonymous said...

KNB i forgot to mention
that i agree what he stands for no i don't follow him blindly.

John

knb said...

John, I'll agree that it is the best country...in that I've travelled extensively and wouldn't choose to live anywhere else. Lot's of offers to me, and my partner...it'll never happen.

My parents were not immigrants. Though on my father's side, they were, in his father's generation. My Mother's family, very old French Canadian roots.

All of that said, to suggest that you do not follow him blindly...I've seen no evidence of that. You support every damn thing that comes out of his mouth. I don't get that.

I don't take your comments personally John, but it would be nice if you didn't attack people who have a great deal of knowledge. Scotian, for instance. Have you read what he has to say? This is not a man who lacks knowledge.

In the end, it would be great to just dialogue.

It's really hot here too, but I'm not drinking the kool-aid, ;).

Anonymous said...

KNB ;)

John

Anonymous said...

KNB i would like to answer 8:45 pm post.
The comment:"but it would be nice if you didn't attack people who have a great deal of knowledge. Scotian, for instance:
"I have attacked him
for what he has said:"Why is it I wonder that so many defenders of Harper and his CPC have such a problem with understanding the English language."Now KNB did Scotian really had to say this ?It intends that
people who are against Harper are the only ones who understand the English language that is an insult to me. So i've ask this simple question:
Are an expert in the English language? In which he still didn't
answer me so i have to assume that he is not.

I would like to answer
this comment you said:
"To suggest that you do not follow him blindly...I've seen no evidence of that." You
have posted so many post
in the past if you notice that i have not answered them all some them because i just didn't feel and others because i did agree with you but i
didn't want give you the satisfaction;);) For the simple reason because every time you talk about the PM he is always wrong
that is crazy,and when you mention Dion and the Libs they are always right.I have never heard you criticize Jack Layton
every time one of our soldiers dies in Afghanistan he comes out
and gives his condolence
to the family which is fine,but then he starts his rounds with the media
and says that our troops
should be coming home now.He can't wait about a
week or 2 before playing politics? He has to do it
during the same day. That to me is dispecable. I never seen say anything
about it. Comment please.

John

Scotian said...

John:

There is a short response in the preceding thread, and you need to learn something now. I am under zero obligation to respond to you let alone respond to you on your schedule of when you think I should, as is equally true for you or anyone else. So either learn patience or get out. Incidentally, you demonstrate a logical fallacy with this: "Scotian, for instance:
"I have attacked him for what he has said: “Why is it I wonder that so many defenders of Harper and his CPC have such a problem with understanding the English language. “Now KNB did Scotian really had to say this ?It intends that
people who are against Harper are the only ones who understand the English language that is an insult to me."

As I did not say *ALL* Harper defenders which is what I would have needed to say for your inversion to hold any water you are quite mistaken/incorrect, what I said was "so many Harper defenders" which is not equivalent to all and therefore your taking offence by claiming that I was characterizing all Harper defenders this way actually does demonstrate a less than solid grounding in the English language by you, even though I wasn't specifically aiming it at you originally, however if the shoe fits...

BTW, you have a rather preachy manner about you, reminds me of another John I once had to deal with, which does you no favours with me either. If you are going to castigate me for something I said, you had better be sure that it was something I actually said, as in this case you were wrong, indeed you ascribed to me that which I had not said and then took it as a personal attack/insult thereby in actuality attacking me personally. If this was unintentional then it was sloppy, and if it was intentional then it shows just what kind of bad faith actor you are. Either way though all you did was discredit yourself with this nonsense.

Anonymous said...

Scotian I'm responding
to your 10:13 a.m.post.
Coming from you the criticism of me I'll take it as a complement.;) Know what they say better to laugh then to cry. So go ahead Scotian and lambast me i don't hold your comment in high regards anyways.

John

knb said...

John to be honest, I think you over reacted to Scotian's comment. I read it to mean that many Harper supporters choose to ignore the facts, even if they are there in black and white. It tends to be a true statement, specifically on blogs.

Anyway, with respect to Layton, I have none. I may not have written about him here, but I have made plenty of comments over time. I think he's opportunistic and concerned only with Jack. I also find him to be a hypocrite. He believes we must honour international agreements like Kyoto, but it's fine to ignore our committment to NATO. In fact, I squarely lay the blame on him, for causing the election.

Obviously, I won't stop criticising Harper, for reasons I've outlined elsewhere. If I profoundly disagree with Dion, I'll write about that too.

I make no secret of the fact that I'm a Liberal, but I don't follow blindly.

knb said...

Scotian, it goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway. Your use of language is but one aspect that makes your comments so enjoyable.

Scotian said...

John:

Weak, feeble, and proof of your dishonesty, thanks for making it clear that you are far more interested in trying to attack me than you are in defending yourself, especially once you have been conclusively shown to have been in complete error. The path you chose to take is the one of the coward and the intellectually dishonest and it is for all to see. Do not expect me to respond to any further questions regarding my writings that you pose, you have shown in this thread that there is no point in bothering given how you run away from admitting you were wrong from the outset.

KNB:

This is starting to sound more and more like the John I had last year, the style of attack and retreat when caught combined with the inability to acknowledge being wrong is consistent. Don't expect me to be responding to John anymore, as I refuse to deal with the intellectually dishonest as you know, and which John has clearly shown himself to be here.

As to my use of language, it is nice to know someone finds it enjoyable, personally I find it amazing that anyone does, I am well aware of my own tendency to be on the long winded side (chuckle). I almost didn't bother responding to John, but I figured that he would keep it up on each thread I commented at here if I did not, and that would have gotten tedious all around. As you saw in my response it was not as if he had an argument to make in the first place, and for him to try and challenge me on the use of English given my writing history online was particularly sad.

You read my original post which he took such wrongheaded exception to correctly I might add. Time and time and time again you and I and many others have discovered that what matters to too many Harper/CPC supporters is what they believe to be true regardless of evidence to the contrary or even lacking any evidence at all for, the liberal media myth being the best known but far from the only example. Take how all lefties/liberals hate the military, hate cops, want terrorists to win, hate religion because of supposedly radical secularism while supporting radical Islamic terrorists, want to coddle everyone instead of dealing with their misdeeds, we see that time and time again being treated as accepted fact/truth within the political right these days, yet the actual hard evidence to support such assertions is either nonexistent or worse fabricated, or at most is clearly a result of confirmation bias and therefore not credible. While it is far worse in our American cousins it has encroached into our political discourse thanks to those like Harper, Harris, Flanagan, indeed the Calgary School as a whole, and Harper's record of actual actions and words show clearly uncanny resemblances to the same concepts being bandied about by the GOP.

I am sorry for having a spat here on your blog, but thankfully it will be ending here, because once someone shows they are not going to act in an honest and ethical manner I see no reason to continue. Personally, I don't know how you have managed to put up with John as long as you have, but then I will freely admit my patience with such folks has been massively diminished over the past 7 years, especially the last 18 months in this country with the election of Harper and the immediate proof by his buyout of Emerson and appointing O'Connor to Defence and Fortier to Senate and Public Works that all his words during the election as well as for the preceding two years about honesty, transparency, and accountability were empty rhetoric yet the CPC/Harper supporters didn't bat an eye and instead hailed these acts as political brilliance/genius. I have seen nothing from Harper since to impress me, and the fact that there are so many cheerleaders willing to swallow whatever Harper is selling because he is "not Liberal"/"not-lefty" but a righty who upsets/offends Liberals and lefties regardless of the actual merits of his positions (if any) is a serious danger to the health and long term maintaining of a democratic system of governance.

Thank you for sticking up for me though today and the other day here, I do appreciate that even if I suspect the effort is wasted given the response John left late this morning once his supposedly righteous defence of my attack on his personage was shown to be a figment of his imagination. Still though, it is always better to have tried and not succeeded than to not bother at all in my books. Have a good evening; I suspect I will be shutting down early tonight to spend time with my wife.

Anonymous said...

KNB if Scotian thinks
that he/she or whatever can insult me and have an effect,;)LOL he/she or whatever is sadly mistaken.;)LOL!! I don't owe him/her or whatever any explanations. Things like him/her or whatever i have no respect anyways. PLEASE scotian
DON'T RESPOND !!!!!

John